Football Forum | Ticket Forum | Off-Topic Forum | All

Big Dawg 11:39 Mon Nov 7
Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Is it safe to say that their departures coincides with the relegation form?

Far Cough 2:33 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Is Irvine not still at the club in some capacity?

He is but it sounds like it's an "upstairs job"


It's obvious he's not influencing Moyes or the team like he was when Moyes was self isolating and we had that ridiculous purple patch when we scoring for fun.

factory seconds 2:30 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

we were utter shit under moyes until irvine came in, and when he left in the summer it took a few months for his methods drain out of the players' habits.

Huffers 2:12 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Personally I don't think a couple of key players like the way Moyes sets up.

Is Irvine not still at the club in some capacity?

Pearce from what I saw on a match day just tended to do the Julian Dicks role of putting the cones out and throwing a few balls up for headers. Then he watched from the stands. I think Warburton is watching from the stands now but I'm not 100% on that.

We are less effective from set pieces this season and Soucek is scoring less than ever, even less than the Soucek of last season.

Ultimately we don't get up the pitch quick like we did a couple of seasons ago, most noticeably in the COVID year in the games against Leicester & Wolves - all of which were really good results at the time.

Lingard was offering something that nobody else has since. Benrahma is the closest to replicating that but the shackles are on. I imagine if Redknapp was his manager he would be performing a lot better.

We have a few very bad (on the ball) footballers:

Dawson
Last ditch player only. Why he has the ball more than any other players on the pitch, every single game is beyond me. Ben Foster said that Pepe Mel wanted to play out the back at WBA and him and Dawson had to go in and say they're not capable of that.

Coufal
God knows whats happened with him. He does not have a bad attitude at all so maybe he's just finished.

Soucek
Peter Crouch in midfield and thats offensive to Crouch.

Antonio
Terrible.

We have some players who are very ineffective in their position:

Lanzini DM
Fornals LM/W
Cresswell LB

Combining the above, we often have 4-5 of those players on the pitch at any one time. 50% of your outfield team not effective, good or modern enough for the current game.

Kehrer I'm not seeing the hype over. A good passer of the ball and thats it. Could see him in DM maybe.

I was roundly abused multiple times last season when I said I would have pretty much any other teams CF over Antonio. I'll say it again, if he has more than 2 or 3 touches of the ball, its ending in disaster. He can score when the ball drops in front of him in the 6 yard box but I expect most people would.

Bowen obviously hasn't reached last years heights. Paqueta needs to do the basics a bit better but he is getting 'assists' when he plays.
Scamacca looked brilliant for a few games last month but isn't getting the service now.

I think Aguerd & Cornet once integrated will improve it.

COOL HAND LUKE 1:16 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

New Jersey 1.07

That's a bit naive mate, if you don't mind me saying so..?

What would you expect Pearce to say? That shit had happened and he wanted out? He has done what millions of others workers do once they've made up their mind to 'leave regardless'... they decide there's no point in rocking the boat for others, and they say it's to spend time with their family, or for various nebulous 'personal reasons', or the travelling / job pressures / change of management dictates it / etc.

What we know is, they both left, and consequently they both seemed to have dodged some sort of bullet within the club's current culture. What we would all like to know is, 'Did they know it was coming down the tracks?'

Far Cough 1:14 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

I've always thought Irvine was the brains behind our success that we had the season before last, if you remember it was when Moyes was out of the picture because he had to self isolate.

COOL HAND LUKE 1:07 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Huffers

Okay. So would you say that Pearce / Irvines efforts were diluted or undermined in some way, or... or... what?

You are probably closer to it than many fans - what would you say has happened? Or is it all under your radar too?

New Jersey 1:07 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

All this is pure speculation. What we do know, as Pearce has said it himself is that he really enjoyed the job but was fed up of the travelling and wanted to pursue other interests including his media work. He's in his 60's, got a few quid in the bank so I don't blame him. I'm not sure what Irving's reasons for leaving were. I do think, however, that we have missed Noble's influence and his link between the management and players.

Huffers 12:54 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

We have been absolutely crap for a year. With the exception of 4 wins in average performance over Xmas and a couple of good performances in Europe last season. Yes, a couple - we beat Seville at home and Lyon away. The others we drew or lost.

Man City at home we also played well in the first half on the final home game.

Other than that, there has been no good performances, win, lose or draw.

COOL HAND LUKE 12:52 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Mr. Burns 12:31 Mon Nov 7

It's been well documented along the way as to what their specific roles were, and also spoken about in various interviews etc.

And no, I'm not going to fuck about dredging it all up for you - do your research like myself and others have had to along the way.

Just a question, though - if all my comments did happen to be 'bollocks', what does that mean regarding Moyes, and what would YOU do next..?

Mr. Burns 12:31 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

'Pearce is a fitness taskmaster - he brought motivation, fitness and discipline to the squad.
Irvine, along with Noble, provided a 'buffer' between Moyes and the players. Moyes is known to be gruff and acerbic to deal with directly - once those two had gone, he had nobody else who could temper his comments and views as presented to the players.'

How do you know all this?

threesixty 12:30 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

I just the saw Roshanne's game assessment and the heat map from Palace. We had a no.10 who's average position was in our half!!

this is dire.

I wouldnt be surprised if a bid came in for Rice in Jan to be honest. And he'd be gone. And that would be it for us.

COOL HAND LUKE 12:23 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Pearce is a fitness taskmaster - he brought motivation, fitness and discipline to the squad.
Irvine, along with Noble, provided a 'buffer' between Moyes and the players. Moyes is known to be gruff and acerbic to deal with directly - once those two had gone, he had nobody else who could temper his comments and views as presented to the players.
You only have to watch him in the technical area - there's nothing pleasant about it, he is windmilling and bawling players out right from the off. They are, I believe, afraid to 'play their natural game' in the face of that onslaught. It has all the appearance of a 'blame culture' and he is now starting to shoot at the fans as well... invariably the beginning of the end.
He should've gone six games in. Ever since the lads lost the last game at Brighton he has really not conducted himself in a manner befitting. Losing that last game apparently cost him a handsome bonus - a cynic could be forgiven for wondering if that broke his spirit and he would actually be happy to take a nice fat pay off and walk away?
And of course, you do have to wonder how Pearce and Irvine felt about Moyes being in line for huge bonuses when those two between them certainly seem to have been the chief officers on the bridge...
I don't suppose we'll ever know, but one sure thing is we can't keep blundering along as we are now.

PwoperNaughtyButNot 12:17 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

This is the problem

And you have to think back to Allardyce and his deluded belief in his understanding of moneyball philosophy which is really just an updated copy of John Beck’s management with a bit of glitter thrown on with big money signings.

Now go back to Moyes first spell with us. It was apparent that Moyes was in this camp of football management and it was dire.

He went away and he came back with a fresh approach and, I think a willingness to learn and evolve.

However, he has reverted back to type and now with the appointment of Warburton to his back team, his methods, ideology, beliefs etc are reinforced by another out of date moneyballer but one with a reputation of being up to the minute and super smart.

Having that behind him has made Moyes resolute in his belief he is right.

Add to that, a majority squad of players that haven’t really competed at the top level and demand to play every game. They are not used to a large squad, squad rotation and squad management across multiple competitions.

With more players, in their minds and with an outdated manager, comes the threat of being out of the team. So they sulk.

And that is where we are.

Big Dawg 12:11 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

you guys are probably right.

Just like so many others trying to figure our our approach play is Tony Pulis Stoke style now.

Charoo 12:10 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

I think Noble being the link between management and the dressing room is a bigger factor.

Combined with the fact we have had to get through a fair few games with no centre backs, Soucek, Coufal, Johnson, Antonio and others have forgotten how to play football and are absolutely fucking useless.

Moyes pig headed, one dimensional rigid set up, no plan B, insistence on playing out of form players, using defensive midfielders as a 10, playing central midfielders on the wing, sitting too deep, not pressing high, not running enough, employing negative tactics, having no idea whatsoever how to use the quite evident talent he has bought, making the wrong subs and making them too late, leaving our most attacking players on the bench or draggging them too early, dropping too deep too early when ahead or leaving it too late to attack when behind and sucking the life and creativity out of his players, might have more to do with it.

But maybe the players miss how Pearce put the cones out a bit!

mallard 12:06 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Eerie Descent 11:59 Mon Nov 7

Takashi Miike 12:00 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

dawg, no i think it extends beyond this season. I thought we were crap for the majority of the second half of last season while psycho was still here, even if the points tally argues different.

Eerie Descent 11:59 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

Far too much is being made of this.

daveyg 11:59 Mon Nov 7
Re: Stuart Pearce / Alan Irvine

As a coach manager neither are that good.
Pearce was never an attack minded coach.
Maybe as a motivator like Noble became.